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Sonia:
And you learned the things to say and not to say and all the good things.
Strand:
And I mean, that’s the beauty of your podcast, Sonia, like the fact that it just happens week by week
They provide these people with the goodness of not feeling so overwhelmed when it comes to being
so inclusive.
I just love that your podcast exists, darling
honestly.
Sonia:
Thank you very much. Thank you very much. No, I know there’s just so much to learn and grow, so if we can
Everyone does it together, so much the better, right?
Strand:
Yes, absolutely.
Sonia:
Okay, so what does it mean to be LGBTQ+ inclusive as a brand?
strand
:
This is a big question, and I think I want to start with this misunderstanding
Misunderstanding of the term LGBTQ+ inclusive versus LGBTQ+ friendly.
Sonia:
OK.
Strand:
Because I hear that a lot, and let’s be honest when we do
You look on Google, you,
When you like a Google business listing, you can actually check a box to indicate that your business is a business listing
LGBTQ+ friendly.
Sonia:
Really?
Strand:
Now I think there is a difference between kindness and inclusivity, and I’m sure of that
The
You will also have some thoughts on this. So I’m very curious to share some ideas
You too, because I think being LGBTQ+ friendly means you are welcome here. Like you
I can come here, that’s fine.
We will do it
With you almost, you know, like there’s, there’s not, we’re going to, we’re going to take your money,
We take over your business, we don’t make it difficult for you. There’s a certain level of acceptance, but it
doesn’t really go much further than that. Right?
Sonia:
Yes.
Strand:
And especially in this business context, it’s like being human
Customer? Great. We take your money. We love this. I think the difference is being LGBTQ+
Inclusive is the proactive approach to creating safe spaces and e
Environments and safe spaces and
Environments are, you know, not just physical. You know, it’s on your mailing list and so on
Your website and on your live calls on your podcast.
You know, how do you actually do everything to make sure people are there?
le in LGBTQ+
Does the community in your company feel safe, seen and celebrated? And if you can check off some of them
These boxes full of safe scenes and celebrations, then I would say that’s included.
Sonia:
Yes. Safe scene and celebrated. I love it. And
Would you say security is the main need?
of people who are part of the LGBTQ+ community?
Strand:
Hmmm. This is real, I don’t know. I think that’s a really good line of thought
It’s probably the primary need when we talk about it
t, you know, Maslow’s hierarchy of needs
and what is, what is the most basic. Yes, of couse. It would be security. Yes.
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And maybe being LGBTQ+ friendly here is, well, no, I don’t even think they’re friendly
is to be sure. So I still do
I think providing security means being inclusive.
Sonia:
Yes.
Strand:
But yeah, starting with security would probably be the best place to start, especially if
You have never engaged in any queer inclusion strategy.
Sonia:
Yes. The reason
I’ve spoken to and heard from a number of people as to why I asked this question
They just talk about how safety is such an important distinction. When I don’t feel safe,
I won’t go. And when I thought about it, it made me think a lot
Anyway, I follow a gluten
–
free diet for health reasons. And it made me realize that every time I go to a store or another
Restaurant or something, of course I want it to be good. Of course I want to have options.
Strand:
Hmmm.
Sonia:
But first and foremost
t, it has to be so safe that I won’t get sick if I eat it. Right? How,
If we can’t do that, the other things don’t matter at all. Right. So that was what defined me
Think about it, we need to focus on the primary needs that people have
certain communities.
And not every community necessarily has it, right? But there are certain things somewhere
Things like we want to be consumers, we want to feel seen.
Sometimes it’s a quote
–
unquote, you want to feel normal but at the same time too
there are certain ones
Communities that are connected to things that make companies want them
Take them into account, you have to solve this fundamental thing first of all before you can even think
about others.
Strand:
Yes. I really like the way you lay this out and I think that’s absolutely right, Sonia. I find
that so that people at all yes. Overcome the barrier of being willing to hang out with you, they’ve done it
to feel like you can spend this month in a safe place
hey. Yes,
Sonia:
Secure. OK. From your perspective, what is the difference between performative allyship?
and authentic allies, especially when it comes to the LGBTQ+ community?
Strand:
Yes.
Sonia:
We see these types of allies emerging in many different areas
There are different places, but yeah, I think what is it?
Difference for you?
Strand:
So I got to the point: I have an online course, an authentic ally academy.
And so in this course I teach this framework of what authentic allyship is because that’s what I do
nk so often
One of those obstacles for business owners and entrepreneurs and I can’t say why
if I say the wrong thing? Or what if it looks fake or symbolic? What if it comes across as unpleasant?
Sonia:
Yes.
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Strand:
So it’s like I, I
I had to figure out how to teach by talking to people
Guys what that standard is so you can be the judge instead of relying on me every time,
I receive a message from someone on Instagram almost every day
Hey, is that funny?
joke or a homophobic joke, you know,
that they want to post on Instagram or you know, can you do that?
Do you give me any advice about what I’m doing?
I think if we allow people to get to know themselves, then you don’t have to ask
expect
that I do unpaid work. You know, that’s certainly something we have
probably both
experience. And,
And what is the framework for understanding authentic allies? And I would do that too
Divide it into three columns and
Sonia:
OK.
Strand:
Then they all start with one, I love the letter A and everything I name these days starts with
an A. So awareness is number one. So that means accepting yourself
–
responsibility to continue training,
understand the problems. It’s just a matter of knowing
.
Right. Number two concerns reinforcement. At what point does your company prioritize reinforcement?
the voices, experiences and perspectives of the group you support?
Sonia:
OK.
Strand:
From a queer perspective, that’s how it is
Do you highlight queer stories? Are you
They celebrate, you know, queer events and queer holidays in a way that’s akin to putting
them rather in front than
Just lead with your logo.
Right.
Sonia:
OK. Yes.
Strand:
So that’s reinforcement
Second. And the last thing is the action, and the action is about you
You know, if you like to talk the talk, then you have to be willing to walk the walk. And you
and I both know Sonia that “ally” is a verb. It’s about doing it
Something, it’s about that
turn up,
It is
about using your own voice. It’s about where you put your, you know
Put your money where your mouth is.
And so there are so many different ways this action can be implemented. And I teach some of them
Strategies in my course, but basically that’s who I am
would summarize is your, you know,
is your pride
Campaign authentic? Well, I would ask questions about what
It doesn’t work
You did it re
Awareness, reinforcement and action.
Sonia:
Pretty.
Strand:
And if you put all three together, then we’re probably somewhere
close to being authentic
Sonia
:
OK. This may sound like it’s coming from left field, but
it came to mind
And
I don’t want it to pop out.
So great. Yes.
Whenever you introduced yourself, you said your pronouns were
them. Right. And so do most of them
Companies that collect information, you know, sometimes it depends on the company
it me
s, they could have a gender on their shape or whatever it is.
And before it was always male, female. And then we started seeing men, women and others, and then
We have found that men and women prefer not to say that there were a number of different things.
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Strand:
Yes.
Sonia:
And I wanted to find out if you had any recommendations for people on what that should look like
How and when should they even ask such questions about recording, about data collection?
Strand:
Yes. I think it’s really important to know why you’re asking this question and whether that’s the case
Segmentation part is relevant.
Sonia:
OK.
Strand:
So let’s do an example, a little thought experiment, let’s say this blouse that I’m wearing now,
You can see it, the listeners can’t, but I’ll describe it briefly and say: It’s very
bright, floral blouse with puff sleeves and I feel like one
I would look amazing in it. Trust me when I say it.
Sonia:
You are doing.
Strand:
That’s why I love wearing clothes that are bright and floral. This is just something I discovered
This has really helped me express my gender identity outwardly over the last six months. I feel
as if I were a
bright and flowery person. So
Sonia:
Yes.
Strand:
When I buy this shirt now, I usually buy it based on a deal
–
unquote women’s store or
Women’s department of a store.
And if someone collects my email address to put it on a list and to you
You know, write an email
If they ask me my gender in marketing and the option is male or female, that’s what I’m assigned
male at birth. And when I’m given that binary choice, that’s an uncomfortable question for me
to get
I often asked
I will, I will choose
ct male. Because I was only given one choice. That’s not mine
Gender, but that is the gender I was assigned at birth.
Sonia:
OK.
Strand:
And then that means that this company can’t really market because obviously they did
made some decisions
Here, in their marketing department and the business model that exists
certain clothing items that we market to men and certain clothing items that we market to women.
We know that there is data showing that 25% of Generation Z, people under 25 and 20, are affected
5%
Generation Z is expected to change their gender identity at least once in their lifetime.
Sonia:
Wow.
Strand:
So this means that gender is not fixed and therefore the clothes we wear are not fixed
not fixed either. And that the correlation between t
The clothes we wear and our gender identity
shouldn’t be held like that
that a marketing department or
or a company is prepared to lose
Marketing to me because they only gave me the choice between male and female. To end this thought
Experiment,
I feel like I’m going on some sort of tangent.
Sonia:
No, that’s great.
Strand:
But I come to the conclusion that I would prefer it if you asked me much more specific questions
are more relevant to what you’re trying to sell me.
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Are you interested?
n clothes? Are you interested in suits? Are you interested in skirts? Are you
Interested in handbags? Ask me questions like that. They are not gender specific, they are gendered
–
neutral questions, but you will receive more insightful information that can then help you
Item to send
Email marketing relevant to things I might actually buy.
Sonia:
Yes.
No, I, I love, I love this thought experiment and I think that you, you, you used the word
intentional in choosing these two words. And these are the focus
of inclusive marketing. For me it is
It’s about consciously deciding who you want to serve and who you are and who you are not. Right.
Because the idea, the expectation, is not that people serve everyone.
This can often be a very big task. Ho
However, in many cases people do not make decisions. And
Because they don’t make a choice, they don’t realize that it’s really them. They are, and, and they are
not intentionally making a choice. They do things like what you expected
G,
whereas you can push someone away because you ask questions in a way that doesn’t do that
Make people feel seen or like they belong.
And you have exactly the opposite effect. So instead of trying to understand more about them, don’t
Selection or production of alternating current
You have no idea how to ask these questions or what information you need
What I will collect can have an impact on how people feel when they visit your client
Experience.
Strand:
Fully. And I just want to jump in and add that
You did that
this comment around,
Obviously, companies and brands cannot appeal to everyone and it is very smart to market something
to a niche, but ask yourself the question, am I marketing to everyone in my niche or not?
Sonia:
Yes.
Strand:
Because maybe I don’t
Be sure to meet a demographic understanding of what you know.
who you think you’re marketing to, but it’s very likely that I’m meeting the psychographic needs
who you market to.
Sonia:
Yes.
Strand:
And so you included me above and beyond
It’s not very binary demographic questions and away, but
Who wants to wear bright floral clothing and we market to everyone who wants to wear it
floral bright clothing
,
And 99% of the time the answer is: No, you’re not marketing to me. They leave
a very
Bad job on it. I don’t feel seen or safe.
I mean, one of the brands that I absolutely love. I walked down the main street and she,
They have a store and I never went in. When I have purchased from this brand, I have purchased it online
And
I have a very fun gender reveal party coming up. Sonia, I, I came out as a non-woman
–
binary and with a major gender
–
Bending party.
Everyone comes, however, you know, dress up, whatever affirms your gender identity. And
so I know that I w
It’s really, really fun to dress up for it. And I was thinking about this brand and
Maybe I buy something brand new from them and couldn’t enter the store because of that
literally on the windshield, women’s fashion.
And I go, I just don’t
Feel comfortable in this space. And right. It is very easy for them
If I had just made a few small alterations I might have walked away with a $300 dress. You know,
It’s just like that,
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Sonia:
Yes.
Strand:
Yes. Well, I don’t know. I’m just like Bri
nging in some examples
from very recent times in my life.
But you know, then I was walking down the street and there was this beautiful vintage thrift store
and I went in.
And what I love about second-hand shopping, other than that
even more
A sustainable way to buy clothing is to not segregate clothing by gender. Do you know how that,
The store is the store and there is no label anywhere that says, “This is a men’s pan.”
ts and that is women
Pants.
It’s just that it’s all the pants
D
Sonia:
Yes,
Strand:
You just have to go fishing. And I love this because it doesn’t do that, it just destroys some of them
Barriers for me. And so I browse through the dresses and then the saleswoman comes by and
She says, “Hey, should I put these clothes in?”
Changing room to try on?
And easy
In that single encounter I thought, “Ah, I would love that, thank you very much.” And
Sonia:
Great.
Strand:
It wasn’t a big deal for her. She was just like, “I’ll help you.” Obviously you’re watching
Clothes, let me
Take them off your hands so you can continue searching. And me
I found a great dress
Sonia,
and I’ll look great on Friday night. It will look hot.
Sonia:
Oh, I can’t wait to see everyone’s photos. Right. So
Strand:
Yes. From all. That’s right.
Yes. It will definitely be on my Instagram.
Sonia:
Secure. OK. Well, we’ll make sure we link it so people can go
Check it out on the show
Notes.
Right. So, okay. Let’s move on, because there’s Sti
There is so much to discuss
LGBTQ+
C
There are several different identities in the community that have unique needs and challenges.
It’s like whenever people use the term Bipo, there are a lot of people within Bipo
The community doesn’t like this term because they think they lump everything together
a lot of people together who
have very different needs and experiences.
Therefore, brands should think about expressing and serving the different identities associated with them
different letters? Or is it OK for them to take an approach, we’re sup
Porting the community as
whole and like it’s a community, kind of, I don’t want to say lumped together, but that’s the way it is, they do it
Do you have to look at them as an individual or is it okay to look at it more as a whole?
Strand:
I think that the answer to t
This question is probably very subjective and depends on the resources available
at your disposal.
Sonia:
Yes.
Strand:
But I think if I were to simplify this to something that isn’t too overwhelming
What’s going to help me get to grips with this is that I’m going to try to paint
an image for people to remember when
You know what a Venn diagram is.
Yes. So we have two circles that cross each other
in the middle. And so one circle on one side is gender and the other circle is on the other side
sexuality
or sexual orientation.
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OK. So if we have cisgender people, people who identify with their assigned gender
at birth and then heterosexual heterosexual people cross that back and forth
It’s in the middle where the overlap is
Is,
that is, what I would say, c
isgender, heterosexual cis, anyone outside of that small intersection is
Part of the queer community.
Sonia:
OK.
Strand:
I hope I describe this well to the listeners. But this picture really sums it up
right down to the two brands. Two bras
nds, that’s a bad choice of words for the marketing podcast,
but I have two buckets.
Sonia:
Yes.
Strand:
When they overlap, cis het is the prevailing mainstream standard.
Sonia:
Yes.
Strand:
Anyone outside of that is not mainstream, not dominant, not standard. Here’s how we can look at it from here
How do we talk to people who are not cisgender? So genderqueer, transsexual, intersex
Folks, this side of the equation. And how does it work then?
we speak to p
people who are,
You know, not
Heterosexual, so people who are bi, who are gay, that side of the equation. Right. That is a
very simplified way to understand it.
Sonia:
OK.
Strand:
But I would say if you can apply these aspects of gender and sexuality to your work
do, then that’s probably a really good place to start.
Sonia:
OK. OK. A
Understood.
Switching gears a bit as we approach Pride Month.
Strand:
M
M.
Sonia:
And there are many similar ones like Black History Month and many other heritage months and
I think people have mixed feelings about the way brands look when it comes to celebrations
captivating. So what recommendations do you have for brands that want this?
o, or think about it
If you participate in Pride Month, do so in a way that doesn’t make you all feel satisfied
stop?
Strand:
Mm mm Yeah, I think if we go back to that framework, that authentic ally framework of
Awareness, amplification and
Action, it’s all well and good to simply change the colors of your logo
Rainbow.
Sonia:
Yes.
Strand:
But if that’s all you do
Sonia:
Yes.
Strand:
Such as at what level of self
–
Consciousness, did you show what I just did?
A disgusting little face, you
knowledge,
for context
T. And then, you know, who are you reinforcing? Which marginalizes
Are you using the platform to tell your story and experiences by changing your logo?
Not much. And what measures did you take then? Well, you’ve done the bare minimum
in addition
has very little impact on your brand. Right.
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I think it’s just like applying
ing these principles and go,
Now, what needs to be addressed internally
What is missing from our brand and marketing campaign? And that’s exactly where it could start
Beginning
of awareness and go, guess what, just for Pride month instead of doing anything external
campaign, we will just be conducting awareness training for everyone in our organization. We’ll just do it
Make sure everyone knows the basic LGTBQ+ terminology
Ogy.
We’re going to make sure that everyone, you know, we’re going to, we’re going to change everything
Bathrooms must be gender neutral. Maybe it’s just a matter of understanding and training your team
That’s all you do for Pride Month. You may not get much out of it
High praise, but this is perfect
Opportunity for you to take advantage of a wonderful
Month. I love it. Dear June. But,
You know, and stuff
could be a starting point for you, that’s great, we’ll use this month to educate ourselves.
Sonia:
OK.
Strand:
If you feel like it
If you already have this embedded in your company culture, then maybe it’s time to do it
Moving on to that amplification level, which as you know, some of our customers are as well
queer and how can we improve them and their experience with our brand?
And you know
Well, I teach a lot of things related to the topic, like collecting testimonials and reviews from queer people
And how do you go about taking that into account in your marketing, but by doing that, you’re saying:
Look, we still want to talk about ourselves, but we want to do it
t through this strange lens or through
the qu
eer perspective.
So that would be,
That might be another way to do it. Just this month we are only sharing customer data
Stories and successes, success stories from the queer community. And then the last one in action
To.
So you might say, great, well, we kind of have all our ducks in a row, you know, how we run things
internals
lly and maybe our marketing,
You know, it has a lot of representation in it.
Now we’re actually saying: let’s support the queer community
ty by running a campaign where
We donate a certain amount of profits to this organization. Or we’ll, you know,
Run a campaign to, you know, lobby the senators from Texas or Tennessee or wherever
In general it is forbidden
pull this week.
You know, right
Sonia:
Right, right.
Strand:
Going to a drag show is an activity you can do and it doesn’t cost a lot of money. Go and take
Attend a drag show with your entire team and support the queer economy. Yes, there are so many
There are various measures you can take, but I think this is it
yes, not only, I don’t, I don’t like to see brands that
Raise the rainbow flag and run a campaign
It’s just like that,
We celebrate pride. It’s like,
Sonia:
Yes,
Strand:
but what did you actually do? Yes.
Sonia:
Do you feel like you’ve seen a brand?
that you were interested and they had nothing
Do you feel like he would feel any way for Pride Month? Or is it not so much your fault?
Don’t really know what other things they might be doing internally?
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Strand:
Well, I suppose
You know, for these internal things, you check your policies
and make sure they are gender neutral, or make sure you are
We give everyone parental leave, and it’s not just like it’s just moms, you know.
things like that.
Since you can brag about it, you should tell me about it because if you do, I will like you more.
Sonia:
Yes.
Strand:
But do it because it’s the right thing to do. Don’t do it because it’s just a, you know, a
inauthentic, performative opportunity.
Sonia:
Yes.
Strand:
But yes, I will, I will definitely engage the brand more as it deals with what is
happened
ng in the queer community. But the negative effect of doing it on a performative baseline
level and doesn’t really go into what it means
to support the queer community,
then me
Maybe then you start asking: Why did you bother?
Sonia:
Her
Uh. So change your logo to Rainbow and release it like a special edition of Pride Month
product, but speaking of which, hey, here’s a policy that we rewrote that involves the community
and how, you know,
Strand:
Absolutely
.
Sonia:
Otherwise, how about people?
le outside yours
Does the company know about it? So that,
These are them
Types of extremes. OK. I like it. Before we start wrapping up, any idea what?
Can brands show that they are LGBTQ+ friendly? Right. As if that were the case
the goal
that they try
Strand:
Including
Sonia:
Come on, right?
Strand:
LGBTQ+ inclusive. Yes.
Sonia:
OK. II Inclusive is therefore the higher level.
Strand:
Yes.
Sonia:
Is that what you say?
Strand:
Yes. That’s what we want to strive for. Yes
H. Yes.
Sonia:
Got it. Thank you for this correction. So what can they do to ensure they move?
more than friendly to inclusive?
Strand:
So I would say, I feel like there are, you know, a lot of examples that we have
chatted
through death
Yes and,
and there are so many ways you can analyze and evaluate your business
Your company, and go, what can we do?
But there are probably two really easy starting points that then also have a really big flow
Influence every decision you make
g forward. So number one, I would encourage every brand to do that
Write an inclusion statement and publish it.
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So a declaration of inclusion f
To me it looks something like:
and I teach, I teach this in my course,
For example, how to write something that also fits your brand voice very well, is very authentic and speaks to you
also a value proposition.
You want to make money from it, you know, make money too. I understand that, but d
o it
authentic and you are
Basically we’re saying, you know,
Well, we’ll support and, and you know, we,
Yes, we celebrate and support everyone regardless of gender, identity, sexuality, race, age,
Religious ability, you know, just making it explicit
that you are not a discriminatory brand.
Sonia:
Yes.
Strand:
I come from the wedding industry and you know, people’s heights are large
Discrimination in the wedding industry.
For example, if you are not thin and beautiful, then there is b
Rands who don’t want to work with you. So me
Make that clear in the wedding work I like, regardless of your height
Sonia:
Yes.
Strand:
You’re welcome.
Sonia:
Right.
Strand:
You are sure to be seen and celebrated. Right.
Sonia:
Right.
Strand:
A declaration of inclusion is therefore s
Something so simple and
You know, really do this
clearly visible on your website, post it every, you know, every six weeks on your Instagram account
Add it at the end of your emails, e.g. B. make it part of your filing
Make sure you communicate this to your customers
They are an inclusive brand.
And the second thing I would do is go back and evaluate it
Te, we’ve touched on this before,
Sonia, but go back and evaluate your ideal market or, you know, your ideal customer
avatar,
Whatever, but you’ve kind of structured that and defined it in your brand. And how many are
Do you rely on someone to have a default gender or sexuality? Are you assuming this or have you done it?
it explicitly?
Sonia:
OK.
Strand:
Do you assume so?
Everyone is going to be a sick woman or have you made that clear?
No matter how you identify yourself,
whether you are cis
–
Trans or Fem Non
–
binary person, we have one
product for you
?
And then delve deeper into the psychographics of their needs, wants and desires
s and their fears as
Well, yes, and it’s much more about psychographics than demographics, because demographics are,
You know, when it comes to being discriminatory, that’s when the discrimination begins
You have restricted your messages to a single person
Identity.
Sonia:
Yes. I love it. OK. I think you have already given an example of this whenever you were
When you go shopping, the woman will be happy to open the changing room for you. Do you have any other examples of a
When has a brand made you feel like you belong?
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H
ank:
I, yes. Yes, I mean, I have so many. I just thought, have something
I have?
What do I have this for?
You? So here in Australia there is an underwear brand that has done this for a year
–
long campaign, how
A campaign around de. was carried out over several years
–
make their underwear gender specific.
Sonia:
Wow.
Strand:
And they came out with an underwear line that was de
–
ge
ndered and they all didn’t hire
–
binary
Models for this campaign. So anyone wearing the underwear was out
–
binary and the
j
essentially said:
You can wear this or that. It doesn’t really matter.
And that in and of itself, I l
I was thrilled at the time when I actually went to her website because I followed her
They have been with them for a long time and it really is a very big brand. I will, I will name them, they are, they are, the
Brand is Bonds.
So if someone I
n Australia is listening
To
bonds,
You will know
It’s a well-known name. And I went to them
website and I saw that I wanted to, you know, buy underwear and there was, I can’t remember
whether it was in the dropdown menu or in the description, but somewhere, oh no, it was
the buy button
ase and the button said “Buy men’s underwear.”
I thought: Wait, wait, wait. They just did this whole campaign around the fact that this is de
–
Gender specific underwear and your button says goodbye, men’s underwear. And I posted something on Instagram
and I called her
out, I tagged them and said, “Hey, wait a minute, you’re doing this campaign, you’re trying.”
to be gender equitable and you have this button.
And within an hour they contacted me directly and said we are so sorry the issue will be fixed. And
then a few h
Later I received another message, the problem has been solved. It’s that it doesn’t have that
more.
Sonia:
Oh, fantastic.
Strand:
And that’s why they’re fantastic. They were just into it. And the same date
Yes, because then it got me thinking,
I wonder who else does this?
Something like that. And Calvin Klein did this during pride,
So Calvin Klein did a Pride collection and it wasn’t so explicit that this was gender neutral.
But they just said celebrate who you are. But at the forefront of their campaign is it
like with men
clothing and
women’s clothing,
like these words.
Sonia:
Yes.
Strand:
And I think that means you haven’t done the work. And that’s why I’m just comparing the two bindings
got the work done. You made a mistake and then quickly fixed it. Right. And t
If someone is like that
Calvin Klein, it’s like I called her that
Well, I haven’t heard from them,
There was no change, you
you know, so yeah. I, it then builds just that level of loyalty to bonds, like: I want to support everyone, everyone
Work you do in this area
because it’s really important and you’re talking to me.
Sonia:
Absolutely. I love these examples. Thanks for sharing. Lots of Pe
Ople can learn
a lot of it,
From there: Where can people find you if they want to find out more about you and your work?
And
Or just join in and see the photos from your party?
Strand:
Yes, so I’m online everywhere at hank paul.co. This is my website. This is my Instagram. It is
my TikTok. In fact, I’m really enjoying TikTok these days. So go, go and look at some of my F
Ashion
Continue traveling there.
IM_Episode 58_How to build an LGBTQ+ inclusive brand.pdf
8 Examples of Inclusive Ecommerce Websites That Drive Growth
